Wet Stuff : The Art of Painting a Business

How to Make More Money as an Artist with Kristine Maltrud of Art Spark

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visit http://art-spark.org 


 KD Neeley, “Today we’re joined by Kristine Maltrud, the founder, and CEO at Art Spark. ArtSpark empowers and equips artists and creators to build successful livelihoods with their creative work. ArtSpark facilitates online courses, live workshops, and webinars, and is the inventor of the Artist Business Canvas.”

KD Neeley, “Hi Kristine, thanks for coming onto the podcast!”

Kristine Maltrud, “Thank you, Katie, it’s great to be here in your space it’s beautiful.”

KD Neeley, “What inspired you to launch Art Spark?”

Kristine Maltrud, “I launched Art Spark because as an artist, I’m a dance and theater artist, very early on in my career I was frustrated by the lack of resources for artists so that they could make a living with their creative work. I was also frustrated by the internalized starving artist that so many creative people have inside them so it’s been in my head a dream of mine for many years and I decided I’m going to do something about it, so I started Art Spark.”

KD Neeley, “How many artists have you worked with through Art Spark?”

Kristine Maltrud, “That’s a really good question. Art Spark was founded, or it started in 2010, so we’ve been working with artists in the US and Canada since that time I think all in all around 400 artists a little bit more than 400 that’s both in person and online.”

KD Neeley, “What has been the most inspiring thing you’ve experienced doing this work?”

Kristine Maltrud, “Wow I get inspired every day by the artists that I work with and the artists I collaborate with because I’m an artist as well. I get very inspired when an artist has a lightbulb moment. When they think about what are ways that I can make a living and have a business and instead of being resistant to that possibility, which a lot of artists are and for good reason, money, and art do not mix easily, I see them switch. I see that, ‘Oh! I’m deserving of this', or, 'I can do this on my terms. This has to do with me making my own choices. It’s not like I have to become a one size fits all I can find something that works for me, so I get inspired when I see that people are inspired and excited by the successes that they’re creating as artists and creators. “

“KD Neeley, What do you want aspiring artists to come away with?”

Kristine Maltrud, “I want them to feel I want them to come away in working with Art Spark I want them to experience a few things we feel like we succeed when they come away, and they feel empowered. They feel empowered to think about their work differently to put their work first to come up with a business model for what would support them financially I also get excited when the artists and creators that we serve walk away with tools that we can rely on over time. I also get very inspired by the community that’s created in the workshops. It doesn’t matter, it’s interesting. It doesn’t matter if it’s online or live they’re always —because we work with cohorts or groups of artists and creators together— without exception, with every single workshop or webinar that we do, even if something’s online the artists that participate, at least a few of them, stay connected and they create community and support for one another.”

KD Neeley, “Yeah”

Kristine Maltrud, “That’s important.”

KD Neeley, “The artists do have their network. That’s how I heard about Art Spark through another artist, Roe LiBretto.”

Kristine Maltrud, “Yeah and that’s the best way it happens is not that you saw a flier or saw something on Facebook that we post, but that artists let each other know about what we do. And that it’s very different, and we’re artists everyone on Art Spark’s team. We’re creating something as artists for artists, so we know what we’re doing.”

KD Neeley, “What successes have you experienced with artists?”

Kristine Maltrud, “Lots of successes. We track our successes and success stories. It’s important not only for the courses to continue and get funding but so that we’re able to make the courses better. Pretty much every time we do a webinar or course we learn from the artists and creators that participate. We always survey at the end, and we find out from them what works and what doesn’t work and how we can change things. That’s one of the successes that the artists bring to us. As far as their successes gosh, Katie, it ranges from basic things like, 'Oh I figured out how to cover my materials with just doing one more show or raising my ticket prices for five dollars.' Or, 'I figured out that I want to do a residency every year. I forgot about that.' And learned that in doing the Artists business canvas workshop, for example, what it is that I need to keep my artistic practice juicy. Some of the artists that have taken the course have gone on to make a decent living, or at least be headed in that direction. To be very clear about where they’re going and to think about the longevity of their practice over time. So they don’t want to let it go. We also have had a few artists who have gotten loans like microloans which are pretty easy to get, but artists don’t know about them. It is important to have a bit of a business plan that you can present to them. Loans, grants, residencies, and also a couple of artists have been accepted into small business or start-up entrepreneurial accelerators or incubators. Where they want to dive into becoming a small business person or an entrepreneur, and they have ideas about what they want to do, and its’ the next step is a small business to do something like that.”

KD Neeley, “How did you become familiar with the Business Canvas Model?”

Kristine Maltrud, “That’s a really fun story. I didn’t know about that book and the original business model canvas until I was at a startup weekend in Albuquerque. I pitched an idea and got chosen to go through the weekend. One of the people who chose to be on my team came in, and he put that book, Business Model Generation, in my hands. It was kismet! I mean it was just like, 'Oh this is what I’ve been looking for!' Because I kept on hearing from the artists and creators that we had been serving to that date, that they wanted more of a foundation in business. Up until that date we had been teaching classes like social media, social media analytics, fundraising, like crowdfunding, audience development, community engagement. Those important skills that are important for artists to know, but when we went back and asked them what else do you need? Almost everyone said, 'I want more of a foundation in business. I don’t want an MBA. I don’t want to take a bunch of business classes. Is there a way that you can help me just with the foundation of business and how it works? And what the words are, the lexicon, because that’s what separates artists from business in many ways. It’s the words that businesses use, like customer segments. It’s empowering them. When that book came into my hands, it was just an amazing moment. I had an opportunity that weekend to work with all nine segments of the business model canvas. When I finished that, it was like this is it! I took it to a group of artists that had been working with me, kind of as advisors. They said, 'This is perfect.' We translated it so that it works for creative people, so that’s why we call it the Artists Business Canvas.”

KD Neeley, “What have you discovered by incorporating the Canvas model into your own business?”

Kristine Maltrud, “How important it is to be profitable. And also to know what your costs are, to know what your revenue streams are. We pretty much knew what our customer segments were, although those changed over time. My team, we’re a small team, and I have gone through our version of the business model canvas for Art Spark five times. Every time it gets tighter, and that’s why I also encourage people who do business model canvas work to not stop at one time because our businesses change and grow.”

KD Neeley, “Yeah that’s the beauty of the business model generation platform is that it’s dynamic it’s designed for the real world “

Kristine Maltrud, “Exactly and it’s easy to re-do you know once you’ve done it it’s like you can tweak it and go am I thinking of the right value proposition am I thinking about the right customer segments because that’s sometimes where there’s a mismatch.”

KD Neeley, “What was the most influential chapter in Business Model Generation?”

Kristine Maltrud, “I can’t put my finger on a chapter per se, but I would say that anything having to do with the value proposition. That’s one of the hardest things for any business, is to be clear about what your genius is and what it is that you are presenting to customers, and the world, and to the world of commerce, that’s unique. That’s what I paid attention to with the book, and there is a chapter of course on the value proposition. Also, there’s a follow-up book.”

KD Neeley, “Oh, there is!?”

Kristine Maltrud, “Yeah that’s all about value proposition where you can just go deeper and deeper and deeper, and so we’ve done that as well, so we’ve used that book.”

KD Neeley, “I’m gonna take a look for that.”

Kristine Maltrud, “It’s easy to find”

KD Neeley, “In the past, you’ve often discussed what you call the ten ways to make more money as an artist or creator. Can you talk to us briefly about what those ten things are and what Art Spark does to help artists tap into them?”

Kristine Maltrud, “Absolutely. So the ten ways to make more money as an artist or creator have come from our courses and these are themes that we’ve picked up as we’ve been teaching and it’s something that we share very freely in the world, so we share this as a freebie. You can get it online you can contact us to get it there’s an infographic and t here’s also a pdf so these are ten ways that we’ve discovered that are very very important and some of it makes it’s like of course of course, but we don’t think about it necessarily.”

Kristine Maltrud, “The first one is to curate your online presence, and we encourage artists to have an online presence but for it to be controlled by them. It's not like you need five social media channels and you need an incredible website. It depends on the artist. Some artists do well just with a bare-bones website. Some do great with just one or two social media channels and no website. It’s a decision that they need to make for themselves, but we do find that online presence is pretty essential. If you don’t have some level of online presence, buyers, and customers, unless you’re doing all your work with people who already know you and come to your gallery, they don’t believe that you exist. It’s weird, and I wish it weren't that way, but we are finding that with artists and creators it’s essential for them to have just the bare minimum. So they come up with a search result, and they can be found. An online presence can be very powerful. You can show your work. You can sell your work as you do. You’re a great example actually, of how important it is and what you can do to make your online presence powerful for sales and just for getting the word out there about what you do.”

KD Neeley, “Yes and it also gets a little confusing when we think online, at least for me because, well I’m 33, I’m not that old but I feel kind of old when I talk to younger kids I start to feel my age when I say online I have a tendency to think about having a website or maybe a FB page but I don’t tend to think about mobile applications, and more and more the internet is becoming a thing people use on their phones”

Kristine Maltrud, “Absolutely, and you know it also depends on who the artist is, the age of the artist, and also the age of the customer. If you’re an artist that’s young, and your potential customers are young, or the customers you’d like to have are young, then you have to have stuff that works on mobile. Some websites work some don’t. You need to come up with something that has what’s called responsive design so that it works for mobile. The online tools that work well are things like Instagram or Snapchat.”

KD Neeley, “Yeah I haven’t touched Snap Chat yet, but I’ve been getting more familiar with Instagram I’ve got a few posts on there now.”

Kristine Maltrud, “Because it’s visual, that’s the thing that’s great about it. We don’t prescribe anything for the artists and creators that we work with except just make sure you have something. And make it your own. If you hate Twitter then don’t bother with it and if you hate Facebook use Twitter or Instagram. Find something that is friendly that you like using, so that’s good.”

Kristine Maltrud, “The second one is to use online customer relationship and marketing tools. This points to automation and how it can be helpful to use automation as an artist creator business. It’s things that are pretty simple like writing a whole bunch of posts on Facebook or Twitter and scheduling them using Bootsuite. Then you can write a narrative and just push out a few sentences at a time. And you have enough content so that it lasts for two months if you’re posting weekly, and consistency is also important. That has to do with online presence, so there are lots of things that you can do to automate your online presence and also your relationships with your customers. Another thing is to develop an email list that’s in an email platform like MailChimp or like Emma. It helps with spam, and it’s a nice way to manage your email lists, much easier than doing it in an email program like Mac Mail or, you know, something that’s native to your computer. The other thing that we find is important, is funny how many artists don’t remember this, very important for you to have some way for your customers to pay you online.”

KD Neeley, “Yeah, Paypal”

Kristine Maltrud, “Paypal or especially if you’re doing a show, as you have up there in front of your beautiful gallery, you have Square so that there’s a way that someone can pay you digitally. Because cash or a check you can lose sales easily. It’s like, I don’t have a checkbook on me, I don’t have eight hundred dollars in cash. I don’t want to do it that way I want to be able to put it on my credit card so that I can pay for it over time if it’s a two thousand dollar purchase, for example.”

KD Neeley, “Right. Being able to accept payments with your mobile device is essential. “

Kristine Maltrud, “Essential. Essential and PayPal too.”

KD Neeley, “Paypal has Paypal Here. It’s like Square. You can plug that into your phone.”

Kristine Maltrud, “Exactly. I think Square though is the least expensive as far as fees go they have the best rates. So important. The other thing I just want to say, and we do teach this in our courses, don't accept checks. People write, unless you know the person and you know how to find them, it’s amazing how many people will write a bad check to an artist for their work I don’t understand.”

KD Neeley, “Have you run into that?”

Kristine Maltrud, “Well, not for my work because people don’t pay me for a dance with a check.”

KD Neeley, “I mean have you run into that with the artists you work with?”

Kristine Maltrud, “Oh yeah, a dozen times. I always ask, because we go over this, how many of you have had someone pay for a piece of work with a bad check? And hands, at least one or two hands go up. Sometimes no one, sometimes there were like five hands go up where half the people in the class have had bad checks over the years. It’s hard to go back after someone with a bad check. It takes a lot of work there’s some bad blood. You know, so I say cash or digital payment. I mean, cash is lovely right? No fees with cash.”

Kristine Maltrud, “The third thing is to get into the mindset of making money. So many of us, as artists, have a very internalized starving artist. It’s like that’s what we’ve heard our whole lives, right? You’re never going to make any money. You’re never going to be prosperous. You’re always going to have to suffer and starve. You know, there’s a certain amount of shininess about that when you’re young.”

KD Neeley, “That’s true. It’s romantic.”

Kristine Maltrud, “It’s romantic. I’ll sleep in my studio. You get past a certain point where you want to do things like have health insurance or have a child or get married or have a partner. It’s like no this is not working. So we have it inside ourselves, and it’s also in our culture. It’s in our culture. There are some cultures that don’t have it. They tend to be tribal cultures. Africa doesn’t have it. Artists in Africa are like indigenous populations here in New Mexico, if you are a dancer for your tribe you are at a very high social level. You are supported by your tribe. It’s the same in Africa, you know? Musician, artisan, whatever, in our culture artists aren’t supposed to make money. We contribute to the well being economically and socially for our entire world, but we’re not recognized for it. We’re not supposed to make any money. So to get into the mindset of making money, for some artists, is hard. Especially the ones that went to art school where being on the commercial side— they wanted to be on the fine art side. The commercial side of the art school, like the printmakers, or the illustrators, were like not the real artists. I’m a painter. I’m a sculptor. I don’t even think about how I’m going to make money. I’m a pure artist. Then you get out of school, or college, or university you have this great BFA or MFA, and it’s like SHIT!”

KD Neeley, “It’s a really funny meme.”

Kristine Maltrud, “It is, and it’s a hard thing to undo, and it’s not like our culture is gonna all of a sudden gonna say hey artists artisans makers designers you are so great we’re gonna start paying you.”

KD Neeley, “That’s a subculture. The fine artist is a subculture within artist groups. The people who buy art don’t see it that way. They just see, 'Oh you’re an artist.' They can do, you know, they know that the sign on the bathroom door is artwork. They know it’s graphic design. They know that the icons they click on every day in their apps are art.”

Kristine Maltrud, “Right right coders. You know they’re designers. Every single coder is a designer. So art and design is everywhere, and we don’t pay attention to it we don’t take it in we don’t see culturally the power of art and design. “

KD Neeley, “It’s easy to take it for granted because we’re surrounded by it.”

Kristine Maltrud, “Oh totally, exactly. Just think if you didn’t have access to color, film, fashion, makeup, digital devices. I mean everything we look at online is code it’s put together by designers and the ones that are real designers with a sense of color and design those people make a good living, but they’re not seen as fine artists.”

KD Neeley, “That’s true. Okay, what’s the fourth way?”

Kristine Maltrud, “The fourth way to make more money as an artist or creator is to learn to adopt and practice good business skills. This is what Art Spark is all about. There’s lots of business training out there for artists and creators, so it’s not hard to find. It’s not very expensive. What we do is not expensive, especially with the online courses that we do. And it is really important to know the world of business and not to be scared by it goes hand in hand with getting into the mindset of making money. Definitely have found that when artists and creators get into that mindset and practice business skills that it’s, I don’t want to say it’s magical because it’s hard work, but it’s a shift that almost universally increases the income of the artists and creators that we work with. So business skills, very very important.”

Kristine Maltrud, “So number five is to get help with the parts of running your business that isn't your genius. This is so important because artists, you know to run your business and also be the means of production. You are producing the stuff that you’re selling. Unlike say you’re a card shop, and you’re going to fairs, and you know events where you're able to buy cards. Then you take them, and then you sell them. But artists, we are also producing the work that we’re selling. To have to do the business side as well can feel very overwhelming. But what we suggest right off the bat is there are a lot of resources that are free so that you can get help especially important with the financial side and the legal side of your business.”

KD Neeley, “Accountants and lawyers.”

Kristine Maltrud, “An accountant or a bookkeeper. It doesn’t even have to — artists don’t have very complicated tax issues until they get well known and they’re bringing in a lot of money. Then things get dicey because they want to shelter their income as much as possible. But the legal side is knowing are you a sole proprietor? Maybe you want to become an LLC. Those very easy things to do and then bookkeeping, making sure that you’re able to write off as much as you possibly can. And artists can do that generally, so those are the two areas. But you know, even beyond that, have someone else do your website. It’s not that hard. It’s not that expensive. Instead of doing it yourself and doing all of the upkeep and the behind the scenes, and the backend of the website, have help with that. You still need to be in control of it. Don’t ever give away control of your website, because it will cost you a fortune. I do want to say that. Then things like marketing and advertising etc. There are a lot of low-cost resources. There are Lawyers for the Arts all across the United States. There’s a chapter in New Mexico. You’re able to get low or free legal services. There are CPA's and bookkeepers that are willing to take on a small collective of artists who want to work with them. And they like working with creative people, so you’ll get like two hours of someone's time and then if there’s five of you, then you are providing halftime revenue for a bookkeeper with a group of you. So that’s something that we’ve discovered. So that’s been helpful. So definitely get help. Don’t do it all. I don’t ever want an artist to be in the place of having to choose to be a good business person or to make art. I just want artists to make art first. The business side has to be taken care of, but as you get better at the business side, you need more help. You don’t want to be doing all of it. You're going to run yourself into the ground.”

Kristine Maltrud, “Next is knowing how to price your art. I’m not going to go into details about that. But very important. I am so happy Katie walking around your gallery to see that people aren’t selling their work for two hundred dollars. You know, people are pricing their art well here. There are different ways to approach it, but knowing how to price your work is important. So that you as the producer, as the artist or creator, are getting paid for your work. So many artists just think this is what it costs to do the materials. They don’t even think about their time, and the only way that you’re going to be able to make a living or make some part of living with your work is so that you price it so that you are being paid as a creator. “

Kristine Maltrud, “And that relates to the next one too which is I feel very strongly that artists need to stop giving away their art for free. All the time we're— Lots of visual artists, in particular, are being asked by nonprofits including social nonprofits, like an organization that works on AIDS prevention or a healthcare foundation. They do silent auctions, and so they ask a bunch of artists to give them a piece of art that they’re going to auction off. A couple of problems with that. If you’re an artist and you have a piece that you’re pretty sure is going to sell at a show, that’s not what you’re going to give away for free. You’re going to give them a piece of work that’s been in a stack of paintings for two years that you want to get rid of. That doesn’t represent you well. It’s not a very good piece of work. I can’t tell you how many silent auctions I go to where I’m like I know this artist and this is like from 1984 when she was in this phase, and this shouldn’t be here. So stop giving away your art for free. Negotiate with any organization that wants you to contribute to a silent auction for free. At least get forty percent like a gallery, you know preferably upwards of that. I think that nonprofits are getting into understanding this at this point. But again, it’s not going to change. They’re so used to getting art for free and selling it so that they have money in their pocket from an event.”

KD Neeley, “Yeah, that’s the standard practice.”

Kristine Maltrud, “It is.”

KD Neeley, “I have to stop and tell artists because I'm doing fundraisers here. When I do a fundraiser here, I have to make sure they understand the artist is still getting paid. The paintings haven’t been donated.”

Kristine Maltrud, “Right really important also it’s tied to the mindset of making money in all the work that Art Spark has done I have never met an artist that is completely overtaken with making money and is all about the money and is moving in the direction of greed.”

KD Neeley, “I have.”

Kristine Maltrud, “Oh, you have! Well, they’re out there. We know they’re out there. Big egos right? But mostly people underprice their art. That’s generally with artists, and even with designers, with furniture makers and stuff like that. The artists that I find are good at pricing their art and not giving it away for free are all the native artists in the United States and New Mexico. They’re jewelry, and their pottery is not cheap, and they don’t give it away they only give it away to their family members and their tribe.”

Kristine Maltrud, “Next is don’t isolate.”

KD Neeley, “Oh, that’s a hard one!”

Kristine Maltrud, “You work in. I work in a room by myself.”

KD Neeley, “I used to.”

Kristine Maltrud, “But don’t isolate too much make sure you have enough space to create but don’t forget that fellow artists and creators are your support network, not all of them.”

KD Neeley, “It’s also a form of sustenance psychological sustenance.”

Kristine Maltrud, “I mean it’s a lifeline sometimes.”

KD Neeley, “Oh yeah. Even if you’re not hanging out with a person physically. Listening to a podcast or a book while you work, or music while you work. I think that’s why so many artists, most of us don’t work in silence. I often work in silence but not all the time. Part of what keeps me company, because I’m spending a lot of time alone working on the painting, part of what keeps me company is listening to a podcast or a book.”

Kristine Maltrud, “Right podcasts are an amazing form of community of connection. No, I’m totally with you, and it’s easy to stay isolated. It’s also part of the starving artist paradigm, too. It pits us against each other sometimes where we horde our knowledge or resources. I find that when artists drop that or relax it a little bit and connect we also are the greatest supporters for one another. To come to the shows too, because people, when people who aren’t artists come to your gallery, they’re getting a contact high with creativity. That’s one of the reasons why they’re here. Having not only the artists whose work is on the wall but having you as someone who is running the gallery and other artists in the space ignites their creativity. Even if they work in a kitchen, in a commercial kitchen, it will give them a boost for weeks. And so it’s important. Our community, our lives are not easy. Community can make it worth it and get us also out of deep craters that almost all of us fall into at one point or another and sometimes often, and that happens for me as well.”

Kristine Maltrud, “Just quickly, number nine is don't be too generous and know your boundaries and limits. Sometimes artists are overgenerous about their time and mentoring someone, or whatever. Know what your boundaries are. And if you aren’t generous at all consider it because it’s a great way you know it’s the gift economy. It’s a great way to get and to receive as well as give. So know your boundaries if you tend to give too much. I don’t know if you fall into that category, I do because you need to get your work done, and you need to get your stuff on the wall, and you need to do all the business side of things.”

KD Neeley, “So know your boundaries and don’t be too generous with your time? Specifically with your time?”

Kristine Maltrud, “It could be with time. It also could be with materials. Oh sure, take all that paint that’s in the corner and use it for your work because you’re young and you don’t have a lot of resources. But it’d be great if you bring it back, but they never bring it back. Or, take my favorite brushes but make sure to get them back to me tomorrow, and then you never see them again. “

KD Neeley, “Well, that doesn’t happen, I’m stingy with my brushes.”

Kristine Maltrud, “Ok good. That’s good. But time, you know to have someone come in here and talk about their work. You know, say I have a half an hour because I need to get back to that painting that I need to get out, I need to put on the wall.”

KD Neeley, “Oh man! I remember when I was studying with Lance Richlin. I came to visit him at his studio and he actually —I couldn’t believe it! He let me sit down at his easel and use his brushes and his paints to practice painting. It felt invasive, at first. I was like, I can’t believe he’s letting me do this! And he was like, don’t worry about it pick that up, lift up some paint. “

Kristine Maltrud, “That’s an amazing piece of generosity. That’s an incredible example of generosity.”

KD Neeley, “That was. That was an incredible experience. He’s such a good teacher.”

Kristine Maltrud, “Well, when you’re a teacher, that’s part of your role. I know that you probably teach other artists in the work that you do. It's kind of, as I know you, I can see you doing that very easily. But it’s also important that we protect our creative space and the time that we need, including time for rest. “

Kristine Maltrud, “And then for the very last one, number ten, we have it as number ten, but more and more I think that it needs to be first. Number ten is nurturing your creative practice. Make sure to make that your priority. And nurturing your creative practice can mean different things. It can be making art, and then there are other ways that artists and creators nurture their creative practice. It can be taking a walk in the mountains or sitting by the Rio Grande River, or the ocean. It’s filling that well, and it’s nurturing a practice. I was at Headlands for the Arts, it’s a residency center outside of San Francisco, recently, and she was saying that always there are residents who come for a long period. I mean they have 1500 applicants for 40 slots— “

KD Neeley, “Wow!”

Kristine Maltrud, “So it’s very competitive. So you’d think that everyone who’s there is madly doing work and she sometimes said they just sleep for a week next to the ocean. Because there’s a beach right down —even though it’s cold, they bring blankets, and they just sleep because they’re exhausted. And so that nurtures. A nap can nurture, staying up all night can nurture, so know what that is and make sure you’re paying attention to that because to have longevity as an artist is, I think, the name of the game. And it’s a choice.”

KD Neeley, I never thought about that before.”

Kristine Maltrud, “Sometimes you need to leave your creative career for a while for whatever reasons. You know, and then for other people, it’s like, if I let go of my creativity and my practice and my artwork I know I'm gonna not be happy. So how do I keep it going? How do I respect the phases of my work over time? You know there might be a period in your work, as with any artist who claims that they’re going to be an artist for their whole life, that’s crap! Meaning that it’s just a phase. But you needed to get through it. You needed to honor that period. And if you don’t think of it as a lifetime’s worth of work, that you’re able to think about and to create, and to participate in —those times when it’s not so nice, because I come across this as a dance creator. There are times when it’s awful, and I’m just pacing. For three weeks I’ll pace. There’s no dance coming out, and if I didn’t know that there was dance on the other end and I just need to get through these three weeks, I might quit. But I don’t because I know there’s something on the other side.”

KD Neeley, “Thank you for sharing that.”

Kristine Maltrud, “Absolutely.”

KD Neeley, “For those who want to participate in an Art Spark seminar, where can they go?”

Kristine Maltrud, “The best way to reach us is on our website and to sign up for our mailing list. Our URL is www.art-spark.org, and you can also find us —another good place to connect with us because we do shout out everything we’re involved with as far as the community goes. So you can find us on Art Spark on Facebook. We’re also on Twitter. We’re also on LinkedIn, but I’d say Facebook is one of the best places. If you want to email us, a great way to get in touch with us is to write This email address is being protected from spambots. You need JavaScript enabled to view it.. So that’s a great way to keep in touch with us, and we’ll put you on our mailing list. We don’t share your email with anyone. And we have lots of freebies that are available to our community, like this ten ways to make more money as an artist or creator. If you go to our website and give us your email address, you’ll be automatically engaged with Art Spark, and you’ll receive a copy of the ten ways document, the infographic which is a great reminder. I know lots of people who have printed out the infographic and have it next to their easel or next to their kiln like reminders. So that’s a great way to get in touch with us.”

KD Neeley, “Thank you so much for your time today.”

Kristine Maltrud, “My pleasure.”

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